ANYBODY IN THE MOOD for one thing simply plain fairly in the intervening time? One thing to look the seed catalogs for, selecting among the many many wildly colourful varieties, after which get able to sow for a outcome that’s all hopeful and brilliant? Nicely me, too.
So after I noticed a photograph of a mattress of snapdragons the opposite day from final 12 months’s backyard of Joseph Tychonievich, I believed they is likely to be simply the factor to carry us all some delight.
Joseph is a author, a plant breeder, and naturally a gardener and the creator of Josephgardens.com and a Substack e-newsletter by the identical identify. It was in his newest Substack submit that I noticed a photograph of his lavish show of snapdragons from final 12 months’s backyard (above) and known as him as much as ask for extra info. Joseph, who gardens in South Bend, Ind., enticed me additional and instructed me tips on how to develop them, and which of them to search for particularly.
Learn alongside as you hearken to the Jan. 27, 2025 version of my public-radio present and podcast utilizing the participant under. You may subscribe to all future editions on Apple Podcasts (iTunes) or Spotify (and browse my archive of podcasts right here).
snapdragons galore, with joseph tychonievich
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Margaret Roach: Hello, Joseph. How are you? Brrr, huh?
Joseph Tychonievich: Yeah, I’m doing good. We’re lastly warming up and I’m doing good.
Margaret: [Laughter.] Yeah, proper, proper. Warming up into the kids, proper?
Joseph: [Laughter.] Proper. Heat for Northern Indiana. Yeah.
Margaret: So I discussed within the introduction that I known as you up and pestered you after seeing your current Substack. However the title of the newest submit there was “Gardening and the One-Physique Drawback: Confronting the Actuality that I Can’t Do It All” [laughter] and it had a photograph of a mattress of snapdragons. However I simply should ask you earlier than we get onto these: The one-body drawback, I believe I might need it, too.
Joseph: Nicely, I imply I haven’t learn “The Three-Physique Drawback,” which is a science-fiction ebook, and I assume it was a film or one thing now. However the idea is realizing that the backyard that I dreamed of after I was a teen, and the gardens I’d been impressed by as a teen, had been typically made by wealthy individuals who had a workforce of gardeners to do the work for them [laughter].
Margaret: How handy.
Joseph: Sure. And kind of this concept, oh, I wish to have 20 acres within the nation with double herbaceous borders and every little thing and an orchard, and it’s like, oh, effectively, I don’t have a workers of 5 individuals to do all of the work. I would like to consider what I as one individual, who additionally has to pay the payments and maintain my cats [laughter] and all these different issues, what’s actually a backyard that I can maintain and revel in quite than getting caught up in imagining this overwhelming quantity of labor that I merely can’t do as one individual.
Margaret: Nicely, it made me giggle, and I believed it was sort of reminder for all of us, kind of interested by the 12 months forward, is to not restrict goals in a destructive use of the phrase restrict, however to be life like, and it’ll be way more joyful.
Joseph: Yeah. So I really feel like I don’t need my backyard to change into a chore or one thing I must do, or a weight, it must be one thing enjoyable and stress-free and pleasurable. And a few of that’s being life like about how a lot time you must give to it.
Margaret: So yeah, snapdragons: There was an image in that Substack submit they usually had been blooming mightily, these beautiful snapdragons [top of page photo and below], in what lots of people name “the hell strip,” the realm between the sidewalk and the curb in entrance of your own home the place normally it’s simply grass or no matter, or a avenue tree and grass. And it was like, whoa, snapdragons there? Wow [laughter].
Joseph: Yeah. So we moved in and now we have very sandy soil right here, so it’s a really, very dry, lean soil. And that strip, they had been attempting to develop a protracted grass and a bit of strip between the sidewalk and the street, which you would need to irrigate consistently. So I used to be like, I’m not doing that. Let’s determine choices for it.
And snapdragons are, I imply, we consider them as a summer season annual and develop them as summer season annuals, however wild snapdragons are from Spain and they’re actually from a fairly dry local weather. So in contrast to a whole lot of annuals which can be actually thirsty and in the event that they get dry, they only wilt, snapdragons really do rather well in kind of leaner, dry situations. So that they’re really well-suited to that individual spot as a result of it’s very public, a lot of individuals strolling by, I need a huge shot of coloration there, however I don’t wish to be out irrigating the sidewalk on a regular basis. So that they do rather well in there with out actually any supplemental irrigation or something, and provides me that huge pow of coloration out the place I actually, actually need it.
Margaret: So there have been a whole lot of them on this image. This was a stretch once more of them. And so in fact my head began considering, oh, go to the backyard middle… And I began instantly lamenting the times of when six-pack annuals [laughter]… You’re already laughing, you realize what I’m going to say: Annuals got here in six-packs and it was a couple of {dollars}, and you bought six little child vegetation that had been sown from seed, and also you’d say, “I’m going to get 10 of these six-packs and I’m going to place 60 of them out by the curb or no matter,” and it wasn’t that huge a deal. Now it’s like, oh, there’s $200 or no matter [laughter], as a result of they arrive in onesies a whole lot of instances in a 3-inch or no matter inch pot. It’s modified, the entire world of annuals.
And I believe, by the best way, of their native southwestern Europe, such as you stated in Spain and so forth, I believe they might be short-lived perennials or perennials or one thing.
Joseph: Yeah, they’re short-lived perennials. So yeah, and a few of them really, there are some species you’ll be able to develop as perennials right here, and even if in case you have dry situations and deep snow cowl, which we do right here, even the usual “annual snapdragons” will overwinter generally, even in a Zone 6 winter, if in case you have good deep snow.
Margaret: Yeah, wacky. So particularly the opposite factor that I beloved about your submit, moreover the headline of the Substack submit “Gardening and the One-Physique Drawback” and the image of this beautiful show out within the hell strip, was the concept that, ooh, if I did that from seed—I do know Joseph grows every little thing from the seed—this might be a whole lot of bang for the value of a packet of seeds, proper?
Joseph: Sure. me, I’m a seed nut. I really like rising stuff from seed, and a lot of that’s as a result of I don’t have a whole lot of disposable earnings [laughter]. And so seed is so reasonably priced if you realize the strategies to do it, and particularly if you wish to do a giant mass planting, as a result of a packet of snapdragon seeds, you’re going to get actually tons of of seeds in that packet. So you’ll be able to just about sow out as many as you might have the area to develop on and do these kind of huge over-the-top shows. However such as you stated, if you happen to go and purchase 4-inch pots on the nursery now, that can value such a fortune. And the opposite piece, moreover saving cash, can be it’s actually exhausting to search out tall snapdragons on the market at nurseries now. The massive field shops and stuff simply don’t carry these old school, taller, actually good snapdragons. So it’s exhausting to even purchase them if you happen to even need it to.
Margaret: So is it Antirrhinum, is that proper? Antirrhinum majus?
Joseph: Sure.
Margaret: Sure. And normally I believe that’s one of many species, they usually’ve been hybridized, however that’s typically a giant a part of the genetics of even the hybrids. Sure. And so that you stated that a whole lot of those now are shorter. That’s what they’re churning out en masse?
Joseph: Yeah, I imply it’s this entire factor. That is so bizarre, actually the large field shops should not rising something there. Every little thing is being shipped in on a semi in bloom, and even a whole lot of impartial backyard facilities now aren’t rising stuff on web site. And when a plant is twice as tall, it takes up twice as a lot area within the transport racks and it turns into actually costly. So there’s this large pattern to every little thing that must be quick and compact. And snapdragons notably, the stems are a bit of bit brittle. You don’t discover that within the backyard, however in transport they break. So that they’re one in all this stuff that’s like, it’s not sensible for the trendy kind of provide chain of mass-market horticulture to develop tall snapdragons. So that they’ve bred these actually quick ones, that are cute, too, they usually have their place, however they don’t have this impression of the tall ones.
Margaret: So when do these bloom? When do I sow them? What season of the 12 months is that this that I’m going to get the present, and the way far again do I again as much as get going?
Joseph: That relies upon a bit of bit on the place you might be. So if you happen to’re within the Southeast about Zone 8, you wish to sow them within the fall as a winter annual as you’d your pansies, as a result of they’re not very heat-tolerant. So for individuals in sizzling climates, they’re good planted within the fall and let overwinter, they usually’ll provide you with a giant show within the spring.
I’m going to sow mine in all probability, effectively, a few of them self-seed and a few of mine overwinter, however I’ll be sowing some. My final frost is in Could, and I’ll sow them about two months earlier than that to get able to plant them out. After which if you happen to do stay space with a comparatively cool local weather, they’ll preserve blooming proper via the summer season, particularly if you happen to deadhead them or minimize them. So that they’ll kind of simply get higher and higher and higher as you undergo the summer season.
Margaret: O.Okay. Do you pinch them earlier than you set them out or something? Or do you set them out and also you allow them to sort of develop?
Joseph: Yeah, I don’t pinch them. I do deadhead them, until I’m rising the double varieties, which you don’t should deadhead, which we will speak about, as a result of they gained’t set seed naturally. However if you happen to deadhead, so minimize them off because the flowers fade, you’ll get much more bloom. They’ll bloom so much higher if they aren’t let to go to seed.
I at all times do, although, let my favourite ones set seed. In order that image I confirmed you, I first planted these the primary summer season we lived right here, which was like three years in the past. So these, a few of mine are my very own hybrids. I do every kind of loopy stuff [laughter]. They’re a bit of hardier than the everyday ones, however a whole lot of them have self-sowed. So if you happen to don’t have a very deep mulch and let a few of them go to seed typically they’ll self-sow and simply preserve coming again 12 months after 12 months. So mine at the moment are kind of self-sustaining in that spot, which is good.
Margaret: That’s wonderful, in Indiana. Cool.
Joseph: Yeah.
Margaret: O.Okay. So that you again up about eight weeks or so from a set-out date that’s proper after the frost date, is that what you’re doing?
Joseph: Yeah. Or a few weeks earlier than; they’ll take a lightweight frost. They’re pretty cold-tolerant. Yeah. Notably that is the place I’m not seed starter, as a result of I’m not exact on timing [laughter]. And I believe across the starting of Could, I’ll plant them out. And it extra will depend on when I’ve time and after I received them sowed. However they’re sort of versatile, as a result of if you happen to plant them out a bit of bit later, they’ll catch up. For those who get them forward early, they’ll take some frost; you’ll be able to plant them out early. So that they’re a bit of extra versatile than one thing like a tomato, the place I really feel like if I plant it and it freezes, they’re useless, and if I wait too late, then they’re not going to ripen earlier than frost in my quick season. The snapdragons do effectively within the cooler temperatures, so that they’ll bloom into the autumn even after the primary frost, and I can plant them out a bit of earlier than the frost and be a bit of bit looser with them on the timing.
Margaret: And are they high quality seeds or huge seeds, or what am I going to get in that packet? You stated it might be a whole lot of seeds.
Joseph: Little teeny, tiny seeds, poppy-seed dimension, which is-
Margaret: So cell packs, flats, what am I doing? Group pots, what am I going to do?
Joseph: I really like group pots,
Margaret: In order that’s a whole lot of seed in a single 4-inch pot?
Joseph: Loads of seed in a single pot. So really I’m doing, that is my go-to methodology for teeny seeds proper now, which is sort of weird [laughter]. I’m utilizing a really high-tech system utilizing these disposable aluminum casserole trays yow will discover on the grocery retailer. They’re like aluminum pans that you’d take a lasagna to a potluck with, they usually include a plastic clear plastic lid that snaps excessive to guard them, if you happen to’re taking them someplace.
Margaret: Like a dome.
Joseph: Yeah. And so they’re super-cheap, I can at all times run out and seize them, and I put simply vermiculite in that, moisten it. I can poke some holes for drainage and put that lid on, after which that retains it completely moist and humid, which is de facto necessary with these teeny seeds. If the soil floor dries out, they’re useless. There’s this fragile second once they’re actually small, so I exploit that so much for my small seeds and it’s super-easy and it really works actually successfully so I don’t should be so on high of watering on a regular basis.
Margaret: It’s like a bit of germination chamber.
Joseph: Sure.
Margaret: And so are you sowing them on high of the vermiculite, or are you masking them, or was there any depth factor or it doesn’t matter?
Joseph: I’m sowing them proper on the soil floor, and snapdragon seeds are a kind of seeds that wants mild to germinate, which is sort of a rule of thumb: Teeny-tiny seeds typically do. In the event that they’re buried too deep they usually’re darkish, they won’t germinate. So that you wish to sow them proper on the soil floor, which can be why it’s necessary to do some sort of cowl to maintain the humidity excessive, as a result of there’s no soil on high of them to maintain that soil moist. So one thing excessive of the pot; even when it’s a pot, you’ll be able to put only a plastic wrap or one thing over a single pot simply to maintain that moist whereas they’re up and germinating. And as soon as they germinate, they’ll ship down roots and be a bit of extra resilient. However there’s this little fragile second once they’re first popping out of these seeds.
Margaret: So on the most, I’d mud a bit of extra vermiculite on high or one thing, however not bury them.
Joseph: Yeah, don’t bury. Yeah, you may simply do a lightweight sprinkling excessive, however I simply sprinkle them proper over the floor and don’t cowl them in any respect.
Margaret: And so then they arrive up on this miniature lasagna pan [laughter], after which do, as we used to say, within the extra greenhouse world of English gardens, do you prick them out and pot them on, or what do you do? Do you allow them and simply transplant them from there into the backyard, or do you set pot them up into particular person containers first to allow them to get some dimension, or what?
Joseph: Yeah, I then pot them up into particular person containers, and I try this fairly early, nearly as quickly because the cotyledons, the primary seed leaves, have expanded earlier than they even put out their first true leaf.
Margaret: Oh, O.Okay.
Joseph: So I do it actually small and one of many causes I like sowing in vermiculite is as a result of it’s so light-weight, it’s very simple to drag them out and preserve the entire root system intact. So you’ll be able to simply actually seize the cotyledons and simply elevate them out they usually’ll pull simply up out of the soil with all of the roots. And so then I plant them out into their particular person pots.
I like that methodology as a result of it’s simpler to maintain that one tray moist. As soon as I’ve particular person pots, it’s a giant space to maintain moist whereas they’re germinating. After which I additionally don’t find yourself with empty pots in my flat, as a result of I can fastidiously put one seedling in each. And particularly if you happen to’re shopping for a few of these… I imply, snapdragons are usually a fairly low-cost seed, however different seeds are generally sort of costly, and also you don’t get a whole lot of seeds to your cash, and I wish to ensure that each seedling grows so I can then pot every seedling that germinates into its personal pot and never have any empty pots.
Margaret: O.Okay. So that you’re saying eight or so weeks in all probability. And that features the time within the vermiculite little cocoon [laughter] after which the potted-on vessel earlier than planting out, earlier than being transplanted into the backyard.
And also you’re not pinching or something, however is there anything? You stated, and also you stated that they had been on this lean soil out by the curb in your specific case. I imply, clearly they don’t should be in that sort of a scenario. They may take it a bit of totally different.
Joseph: They’ll develop in fairly wealthy soils they usually’ll be comfortable in that. Yeah, I’m not likely very… I assume the one different factor is I’m rising them beneath lights indoors whereas it’s under freezing, however I attempt to begin carrying them exterior into the solar nearly as quickly as I can. So even when now we have a bit of heat spell early on, I like to maneuver them exterior, as a result of it helps harden them off and get them used to the ultraviolet mild and the extra intense daylight exterior. And since they do develop effectively in cooler temperatures, as you realize, within the spring, it’s like now we have every week of chilly and every week of heat, and people weeks of heat, I’ll transfer the entire flats exterior into the sunny space to allow them to develop exterior as a lot as I can and solely carry them again inside is when it’s turning chilly once more.
Margaret: It’s so fascinating as a result of I put every little thing on nearly like trays that you’d carry if you happen to had been serving meals, like bringing to the dinner desk or to placed on a TV tray or one thing. I put all my flats and pots and six-packs, I put them on trays like that, my flats, as a result of I carry them out and in. I do precisely what you simply stated. If the day is 40 levels or one thing, I carry the stuff out. I don’t put it proper out within the full solar the primary minute, I put in a protected spot, in order that by the point mine are prepared or age-wise or no matter, they’re additionally hardened off already. They’ve been coming out and in.
Joseph: Yeah, yeah.
Margaret: Oh, fascinating. Oh, I didn’t know you probably did that, too. [Laughter.] I believed that I used to be the one loopy individual.
Joseph: Yeah, so I discovered particularly if you’re rising beneath lights, the lights don’t produce any ultraviolet mild in any respect, which is the primary factor that causes the leaves to burn. And there are some compounds the leaves can develop as soon as they’re uncovered to ultraviolet mild to guard them, however a few of it’s within the construction of the leaf because it grows. So a few of these older leaves that developed beneath the lights won’t ever actually develop that full capability to withstand full brilliant daylight. So I wish to get them not less than a bit of shot of precise direct daylight as early within the rising course of as doable, in order that they begin rising these leaves which can be morphologically capable of deal with the daylight with out burning.
Margaret: So a number of the humorous issues I used to be studying about them after we talked on the telephone the opposite day: They’re known as snapdragons, however they was known as calves’ snouts and lion’s mouths. They’d all these loopy names. And so they’re associated to foxgloves and to turtleheads to different issues that kind of have roughly that sort of form of flower, proper? And bees like to get into flowers like that. And I believe typically hummingbirds could also be focused on flowers of these shapes. It in all probability will depend on the colour, I don’t know.
Do you might have varieties that, I imply… I do know you’ve been hybridizing and so forth, however for these of us getting began, selection sources, any instructions that approach of issues to information us? I imply, I used to be in fact already thumbing via the catalogs [laughter].
Joseph: Yeah, I imply, I’ve some favourite varieties. One factor I wish to say about speaking concerning the form of the flower, one factor that’s fascinating, is that smaller bees can’t get into them, so that they should bodily pull the flower open. And honeybees should not sufficiently big to get right into a snapdragon flower. So curiously, honeybees, which aren’t native in North America, will utterly ignore snapdragons, however our native bumblebees and the carpenter bees which can be huge and powerful sufficient to drag these flowers open, love them. So really, despite the fact that they’re not native right here, they’re meals supply for our native bees as a result of they don’t should compete with honeybees to attempt to entry them.
However favourite varieties, there’s one, a pair, that I actually love. One which I like is an previous selection. I’m unsure how previous, however ‘Black Prince’ is [above, from Select Seeds]. It’s a deep crimson that does nearly veer into black. It’s a lovely darkish, deep crimson flower. After which the foliage itself has a deep reddish coloration to it as effectively, which is de facto, actually fairly.
Margaret: That’s so humorous you say that due to course, what do I’ve written down right here? One thing from Choose Seeds catalog, which is strictly what you simply described. That’s precisely what attracted my eye was like, whoa, that is actually dramatic.
Joseph: Yeah, it’s actually dramatic. It’s actually, actually cool. There was one other selection some time in the past that had darkish foliage, too, with totally different flower colours, but it surely was not vigorous in any respect. However this one, and I believe that is an previous heirloom selection that in all probability then does go by a couple of totally different names, however the foliage is de facto, actually lovely and it’s a extremely vigorous and appears nice, that basically intense coloration.
Margaret: Another goodies?
Joseph: One other one I really like is ‘Evening and Day.’ And once more, there’s comparable varieties. That one, the tube of the flower is white after which I don’t know, can we name them the lips, are this intense crimson. And the distinction is de facto fairly dramatic as a result of it’s like a darkish crimson and white they usually provide you with this actually unimaginable bicolor look to the flower.
Margaret: And I imply, I may do these in pots or a window field or I imply a lot of alternative ways, proper? I imply, it’s not like I’ve to place them within the floor.
Joseph: No. And there’s an enormous vary in heights, and that’s one thing you’ll be able to look, so if you happen to have a look at like Choose Seeds and Johnny’s Chosen Seeds… Johnny’s principally could have a number of the actually tall ones, as a result of they actually cater to the cut-flower market. So you will get these ones which can be like 3 ft tall, that are actually lovely. Among the actually huge ones do want staking—nice minimize flowers and actually dramatic, that are in all probability higher within the floor. After which go right down to smaller ones that also have these good spikes, however have extra like 12 inches, 18 inches, that are in all probability higher for a container rising simply from the dimensions of them.
Margaret: Wow. And there’s such a coloration vary, and as you stated, there’s bicolors. There’s ones which can be kind of mottled in colours, edged in several coloration. I imply, it’s just about one thing for everybody.
Joseph: The opposite fascinating ones to search for are the double-flowered ones. So the [Madame] Butterfly collection and Twinny collection are each double-flowered ones which have additional layers of petals, which if you happen to love the snapping of the flowers, if you happen to love that traditional form, they don’t have that as a result of it’s sort of an open kind. However what’s fascinating is the double varieties won’t set seed until they’re hand-pollinated, so that you don’t should deadhead them to get the bloom as a lot. So if you happen to hate deadheading, on the lookout for both Butterfly or Twinny or a number of the different double-flowered ones, they normally gained’t set seed themselves. And so you will get that good repeat bloom with out kind of the useless heading that goes together with it. [Above, from Swallowtail Gardens catalog, the peach version of the Twinny series.]
Margaret: They don’t have any perfume. Is there a brand new perfume?
Joseph: They do, and I don’t know I ought to have. So there’s a unique species, Antirrhinum siculum, which is among the wild species that has… it smells, it’s like a honey scent; it’s a extremely, actually fantastic scent. And infrequently you’ll scent them within the fashionable hybrids. However as with every little thing, in a whole lot of flowers, perfume, and the way lengthy the flowers final in a vase are inversely associated. So very aromatic flowers are inclined to fade shortly.
Margaret: Oh, fascinating.
Joseph: And scentless ones will final so much longer. And since snapdragons have been bred for a very long time for the florist commerce, a whole lot of the perfume has been bred out of them, as a result of the aromatic ones don’t final effectively in a vase. So generally in heirloom, like actually old school snapdragon varieties, you will get a few of that scent or a number of the different species, but it surely’s sort of hit or miss. And a whole lot of these kind of fashionable hybrids don’t have any perfume.
Margaret: Another annuals, if I’m procuring round—and once more, I may use a burst of coloration [laughter] and delight on this mad, mad world we’re in in the intervening time—anything that’s sown this fashion that you simply use your little lasagna foil pans with the domes and the vermiculite? I imply, is there anything that I do that approach?
Joseph: Yeah, so I exploit just about the very same methodology for my pansies that I begin within the fall or earlier spring; petunias are mainly very comparable dimension seed and germination. And petunias, I really feel like we expect petunia appears so boring, however you will get into these old school petunias. Some have large flowers, and fragrances. There’s a whole lot of, once more, range that’s misplaced in kind of the mass-market horticulture. Actually just about most of your annual seeds, you can begin this fashion.
After which I simply use a rule of thumb of if it’s a teeny seed, I sow it on the soil floor. And if it’s larger, I attempt to cowl it with a depth equal to the scale of the seed as a kind of rule of thumb. However yeah, just about, particularly if you happen to’re wanting, I imply we each love Choose Seeds; it’s a nice catalog. A few of these off-the-beaten-path annuals, this kind of primary methodology will work with a whole lot of various things to your backyard.
Margaret: Nicely Joseph, I’m so glad to reconnect, and I’m so glad that you simply did that current Substack submit that basically grabbed me as a result of I believed I had the one-body drawback. So thanks, and I hope we’re going to be in contact frequently. I wish to see what different loopy stuff you’re going to do moreover planting snapdragons in your hell strip and so forth. I can’t wait.
Joseph: Nicely, I might love that. It was so good speaking with you.
(Pictures from Joseph Tychonievich besides as famous.)
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MY WEEKLY public-radio present, rated a “top-5 backyard podcast” by “The Guardian” newspaper within the UK, started its fifteenth 12 months in March 2024. It’s produced at Robin Hood Radio, the smallest NPR station within the nation. Hear domestically within the Hudson Valley (NY)-Berkshires (MA)-Litchfield Hills (CT) Mondays at 8:30 AM Japanese, rerun at 8:30 Saturdays. Or play the Jan. 27, 2025 present utilizing the participant close to the highest of this transcript. You may subscribe to all future editions on iTunes/Apple Podcasts or Spotify (and browse my archive of podcasts right here).